Americans Don’t Want Health Insurance? Since When?

Because of Obamacare, many Americans are now insisting they shouldn’t be forced to have health insurance. But here’s what I’m not understanding: Don’t you want health insurance?

When I graduated from college, there were a few months prior to starting my first “real” job when I didn’t have health insurance. Or I wouldn’t have, at least, if my parents hadn’t insisted on it.

Even though I was a healthy 21-year-old, my parents wouldn’t have considered allowing me to exist without health insurance, even for one day. Why? Simple.

As my parents, they would have felt obligated to step up financially in the event of a major health care catastrophe. They worked exceedingly hard their entire lives to accumulate their nest egg. There was no way they were going to allow me to put that at risk because I was too stupid or cheap to shell out a couple of hundred bucks for insurance.

I’ve gone through life ever since assuming there are only two kinds of people: those who had health insurance and those who needed it. And until recently, that belief has been borne out. While I’ve certainly met people who couldn’t afford health insurance, I’ve never met a single person who didn’t want it.

So imagine my surprise — shock, really — to recently learn that apparently a lot of my fellow citizens not only don’t want health insurance, they’re absolutely livid at the suggestion they be forced to buy it.

Here’s a recent comment from our Facebook page. I’ve seen many in the same vein all over the Internet and on TV.

I’m looking for people who want to join me to sue the government when they try to penalize us for not buying health insurance. Can the “land of the free” force us to buy something that we don’t want, or don’t need?

Forget being a Republican, a Democrat or independent. Comments like this leave me honestly confused. How can you not want health insurance? How can you not need it? What are you going to do if you get sick and start getting bills you can’t pay? More to the point, what are you doing now?

Is the mandate the problem? 

The only possible reason I can conjure up for so many people being so angry is because Obamacare involves the government making us do something. Is that it? If so, I get it. At least, kind of.

I wasn’t happy when my state passed a law requiring motorcyclists to wear helmets. Nor was I thrilled when seat belt laws came into vogue. In my mind, I was only risking my own safety, so it was nobody else’s business. Then it was explained to me: If my lack of a helmet or seat belt resulted in injuries requiring treatment beyond my ability to pay, the burden would fall to society. So society had a right to mandate that I protect myself from myself.

That’s something I could understand. And lo and behold, it’s the same argument behind Obamacare. Not similar. It’s identical.

There are other government mandates and actions I’ve taken exception to over the years. I’ve never been happy about my fellow citizens potentially spending years in prison (at my expense, no less) for smoking pot. I’ve never been wild about 25 cents of every dollar I pay in income taxes going to pay for weapons and warriors. I’ve always found it odd that I pay thousands in property taxes to support schools when I have no children. And should I fail to pay them, the house I paid for can be seized and sold.

You get the point. No matter what your politics are, you can always find something a government agency mandates that you don’t like. And from mandatory car liability insurance to mandatory draft registration, our nation has been full of them since I’ve been around. 

But health insurance? Here I get confused. It makes no difference to me whether the government mandates it or not, because my parents, along with common sense, made it a personal mandate long ago. If you don’t have insurance, get sick and run out of money, you’re OK with allowing your fellow citizens to foot your bill? How do you justify that?

So you tell me: What’s the beef?

I ask this question honestly and without judgment of any kind. I’m simply trying to understand why anyone, of any political persuasion, demographic or income category would voluntarily choose to go through life without health insurance.

After all, except for those relatively few who die suddenly, we’re all going to get sick someday. And even if you’re wealthy enough to pay the bill — which few of us are — you certainly wouldn’t want to. So, for those of you out there who are screaming about how you don’t want health insurance, please help me understand why.

Don’t tell me about why you hate Obamacare: I get it. Don’t tell me you hate mandates: I’m with you. But if you simply don’t like health insurance — and that seems to be what the reader above and many others are saying — I’m lost. Please take a minute and help me understand why you don’t want or need health insurance, as well as what your backup plan is.

Comment below or on our Facebook page. Seriously. I’m dying to know.

Stacy Johnson

It's not the usual blah, blah, blah

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  • nitemare2

    This ACA will change nothing the old law is still in effect and those who still choose to not buy insurance will still get guaranteed treatment and the taxpayer will still be left with the bill if they don’t pay, think illegals and those who still can’t afford these premiums or deductibles and copays. So now I will pay for your insurance and those who still use the ER as their Dr. better known as the liberal double whammy of redistributing my money

    • bud

      I feel sorry for you but you are most likely like a guy I know in central florida . he thinks the tea party is the greatest/ they are going to protect him from his taxes going up. his assets are a broke down van makes bout 10 gran a year. but thinks the dems are gonna tax him to death. in other words he aint got nuttin never will. he got in a bad car wreck cost 350 gran. still alive bitched about not getting the drugs he wanted for free.sound like you and your friends only good things are what ya can get free . anyone else even if they want to pay are taken your stuff. there is a name for that illness by the way it s foxitist. there is a cure turn off your tv read a paper

      • nitemare2

        I love when liberals think that by calling names or racist and belittling people they do not know because of their party mantra it makes them seem knowledgeable and right. Everything must come from FOX and we want dirty water and air, the old to die and the education system to continue the way it is. Bud you don’t know me or what I have. But lets look at some facts. The Tea Party wants lower taxes that’s right but how do they want that done? Cut spending on things the Govt. doesn’t need like millions to watch a shrimp walk a treadmill or the millions funding a TV reality show in INDIA, or the millions subsidizing the snacks on the Amtrak trains $833.8 million over the past 10 years. How about the billions subsidizing the public transportation systems altogether? How about the billions Obama has dropped in the hole of the failed green energy companies? And where do you see any Tea Party member asking for anything ‘ FREE” from the Govt. That is the liberal/progressives mantra, go back and read the signs of the Occupy movement, applauded by Pelosi and Reid and Obama. What paper do you read the WP, NYT the daily Koss, you must listen to Matthews and Maddcow maybe the screamer Ed. But really it just makes you look like an a$$.

        • bud

          did nt call ya a name just said what you are ya and your hero mitt pays 11% his horse is a 500 thou write off he has off shore accounts but I m sure you think he is a patriot just like 5 time deferment cheney and deserter gw but hey fisrt ones to want war and not pay for it hero s all rite

          • nitemare2

            Again you assume that I voted for Romney. You make a lot of derogatory statements can you back any of them up with any facts other than those from some liberal lie site? First ones to want war? Did you pass history in school or is that to much to assume. Go back and see how many wars were started under the Democrat Presidents, then check and see how many wars were paid for before they involved us. I’ll give you a hint NONE. Vietnam JFK got us involved and LBJ increased the amount of involvement. Paid for by tax dollars. Are you really that stupid or just that blind to the facts?

          • bud

            present time I guess Hercules was probably a dem . 10 dollars to make a million dollar bomb who s party do ya think that’s about. bama put the wars on the books but hey that’s just now we don t want to think about now it is nt good

          • nitemare2

            Keep mumbling they will give you your crayons shortly

  • Sybil M.

    It is significantly smaller than 80 million, but it is negatively impacting most of the country.

    We aren’t getting what Congress has. In fact they exempted themselves from the program.

    If it is all for special interests, as you alluded, then why would we want it?

    • ed M

      Why keep telling lies? Congress is not exempted! look it up!

    • Eric W

      They aren’t exempt, and you’re also twisting his point a full 180. The people in congress fighting against the ACA are doing it at the hands of the insurance lobby and other special interest groups. He’s not saying the ACA is for special interests. The ACA is anathema to special interest groups. The market will now be competitive from both the standpoint of customers and businesses, high risk because of the uninsured will no longer drive prices up for everyone, and we will spend less on healthcare in the longrun.

      Healthcare is an inelastic good. If the pills you need to save your life cost $25 a month, you’ll buy them. If they cost $250 a month, you’ll buy them. Insurance companies have been competing with each other – but it’s not true competition. The market forces are one-sided. As long as they steadily drive prices up *in tandem* with each other, people will still be forced to pay whatever they charge. If a single buyer is choosing the medical supplier with the lowest defect rate and the lowest cost, medical suppliers will be driven to compete with each other rather than indirectly colluding. The same thing applies to nearly all of the costs of healthcare.

  • jaimie bisbee

    my step-mum just bought a nice six month old Mazda by working off of a macbook air… this website w­w­w.J­A­M­20.c­o­m

  • Dottiex

    Absolutely beautiful! A wonderfully well-written article.

    I myself don’t have health insurance right now and it scares me. I’ve had it all my life except for the last year and a half, and totally agree that it’s a necessity. I left AZ in 2010 with my husband and severely disabled son to get insurance for our son in Oregon. (He lost it in AZ due to the Great Recession. His disability income was just $24/mo. too high for him to any longer qualify for benefits there due to the massive budget cuts by that state. If AZ supports the Medicaid expansion as Governor Brewer is trying to do, he could live in AZ again in 2014.)

    My husband and I ended up paying $1450/mo. for COBRA several months after moving to Oregon. We paid it because my husband has several serious conditions and we couldn’t contemplate not having insurance. (We thought we would be going back to AZ where I had a job and would find a group home easily for our son. It didn’t work out that way. We didn’t originally plan on having to pay so much for COBRA.)

    We are now totally broke and are living on Social Security only. My husband got on Medicare last year, but I won’t qualify until 2014. So, for the past year and a half, I’ve been without insurance. We simply can no longer afford it.

    I wouldn’t change anything. We all have survived and are happy in Oregon. I only have a few more months left to get insurance. There’s no way I would have left my husband and son without insurance. But I’m glad that with the Affordable Care Act others won’t have to lose everything. It’s a good law. I too don’t get why other people don’t appreciate it. Our family certainly does!

  • kadacozarh

    I have always carried insurance. Sometimes we got it through an employer sometimes that was not an option but I have always made sure my family was covered one way or the other, I couldn’t sleep at night if I didn’t. I would have been worried sick something major would happen. We have not had a vacation in 13 years because we cannot afford one but I have continued to keep my insurance, At one point the policy I had through hubby’s employer started to cost me over $700 per month. It was equal to our house payment, That is when I went looking for something more affordable through another insurance company and I found one for $94 per week. Much better. NOW thanks to ACA that policy is no longer going to be offered but a similar one will and it will cost me $52 more per month.

    The problem I have with ACA is that it is NOT going to fix anything. Our health care system is broken. We have health insurance companies making billions in profits every QUARTER. We have hospitals-even some that are not for profit-building ridiculous resort type buildings focusing more on fancy things than on the business of healing people. We have doctors who only want to work 4 days per week,no nights and no weekends and still live in mansions. We have drug companies spending billions of dollars per year on advertising both on TV and in print and when asked why their drugs cost o much they claim it goes to research.

    Greed is the biggest problem with our health care system. Greed by the insurance companies, the hospitals ,the drug companies and the doctors. And now the government,seeing all that money going elsewhere, wants in on the action..

    • bud

      do you want the ability to have health care or do you want a bunch of lawyer taking 40% of your money and putting it in their pocket no matter what. at least you know next year your ins premium won t be 900 month because they now have to justify it not just charge what ever they can get away with hope you will understand I trust my fellow man more than any ceo . sorry that’s just me if they were lookin after us the most employees would be doctors and nurses not lawyers to figure out how not to pay jusy my opinion

  • Yvette

    I don’t want health insurance because the type of health care I believe is best is generally not covered by insurance companies. I do not feel that drugs and surgery are the best ways to treat most medical conditions (although they are indispensable in emergency situations). I believe alternative medicine (naturopathic, chiropractic, herbalism, energy medicine, etc.) is hands down much more effective in bringing about real cures than mainstream, “conventional” medicine. Not only do I feel alternative medicine is superior, I also feel that the use of drugs in the body is quite dangerous when used over time. Many conventional doctors put patients on drugs for years or “for life.” If energy medicine, naturopathic, herbalism, etc. were covered, I’d be all for signing up.

    • lestye

      So you’re hurt in a car accident, or get a positive for cancer on your pap test or breast exam, you have no problem stiffing the rest of us with higher premiums to pay your bills? Thankfully, the ACA won’t let you get away with denying all responsibility anymore.

      I believe in alternate healthcare as well…and there are insurance plans that cover them… but I feel enough responsibility for myself to be sure I’m covered in emergency situations that can happen anytime.

      • StrangerInAStrangeLand1

        In that case we should be able to buy a catastrophic or accident plan, neither of which will now be available as a “primary health insurance policy”. No, we are expected to buy a one size fits all policy and shove scads of money at the insurance company, and the individual mandate is a government gun pointed at your back to force you to buy.

      • Yvette

        You say you believe in alternative health care, but it’s obvious you know little about it. If you did, you would not have made the uninformed statement re: positive results for cancer on a pap or breast exam (which alternative medicine cures quite nicely, thank you). As you know nothing about me, you ASSume I have no problem “stiffing the rest… with higher premiums to pay [my] bills.” If I were hurt in an accident, I’d use my emergency accident insurance for that situation (which is separate from medical insurance). It’s amazing how quick you are to judge someone you know nothing about, accusing them of “denying all responsibility.” Covering myself with accident insurance and knowing how to conquer so-called “incurable” diseases is plenty responsible, I’d say.

  • guest

    How about insurance reform? The Insurance companies are the blood suckers here. How about a cafeteria plan? I can choose the different parts of insurance that I want, and pay for ONLY what I want covered. If YOU want to be covered for every possibility, YOU pay for it. If I only want catastrophic care, I pay for that.

    • nitemare2

      The insurance companies would be happy with that but the Govt is has told them what they must cover.

      • bud

        you rea;lize most of the stuff you don t like such as forced or fined are rethugs mandatory stuff go bac and look at the crap they forced in there for saying they would vote for it then they got all the bad that they keep pointing out and still did nt vote for it. just a tiny bit of research would enlighten you immensely

    • Giershift43

      why is health insurance for profit?? Paying profits also drive up costs

    • Giershift43

      One thing that may help is to stop allowing Health Insurance to be for profit. Stop having insurance executive paid to make money off a necessity.

  • Patch Rowcester

    “a teenage boy and two little girls to feed and clothe without help from the agencies in your state.”

    Are you saying you have three kids? Whether you agree with ACA, or Obama, I don’t think you have anyone to blame. Three kids in this economy, and you are complaining that you don’t have enough? Well of course you don’t.

    • Giershift43

      Overall I agree that as a whole too many people are too casual about having children without regard for the cost to themselves and society as a whole. But that too is a freedom part of our nation. But I would urge people to think twice about having a large family when we no longer live on farms where kids were used to work. They are a financial liability today. And for heaven sake, let’s fund birth control and education about more than just sex, but about responsibility.

      • Patch Rowcester

        I agree that in this nation we have the freedom to choose, but too often, people take that freedom to make choices, and then blame the government (or whatever else is convenient) if those choices don’t work out.

  • Mrs Bryant

    i am in agreement with most of the comments….. i see both sides…. i work, however my mother is 63, was laid off of her job 5 years ago and lost her home because of it…. she has been trying to get work all of this time but the only work she has been able to get is registry work. So course, she does not have insurance….nor can she afford it. She desperately needs gall bladder surgery, but we cannot afford it…. the insurance premiums being offered are too high. She recieves my fathers social security and it is $100 more than what is allowed to qualify for assistance… of course my job wont allow me to add her on to my insurance… so how did obamacare help this situation??? the intention was good but there is a large portion of the population that it doesn’t help… she can’t afford the insurance and as if she had extra money, now she can expect to be further penalized if she doesn’t figure something out…. she isn’t old enough for medicare and for the fist time in her life, she actually needs some medical care…. this is a huge problem and i am sure that it is affecting a lot of people in her age group similarly….

    • april showers

      You and your mom should do some research at the library or online so that she can solve her gall bladder issues WITHOUT SURGERY. The gall bladder is pretty important and removing it will cause additional problems with her digestion system!. But most surgeons want to make lots of money so they will tell you that removal will solve her problems! Not true! I wish I had my gall bladder back! Good luck!

  • april showers

    The purpose of insurance is to protect assets that have taken a long time and much energy to accumulate. People with NO ASSETS and/or low income levels don’t really need insurance. But you already know this. This whole article is pure propaganda and therefore, you are a hack writer.

  • Mrs Bryant

    my mother has done everything at home to manage….. she has researched and tried EVERYTHING….. in the last three years, she has lost about 60 pounds due to the inability to eat when she gets her attacks…. she has multiple stones, lithotripsy would be ideal….. i would prefer she not have surgery but she definitely needs something to maintain some type of quality of life…. she lost her job, her home, is willing and wanting to work anywhere that will hire her, she has never been lazy and unwilling to help herself….. she has applied EVERYWHERE but i guess they think she is too old…. from fast food restaurants, to liquor stores, you name it, she has applied…. and yet because of the tax incentives that companies recieve if they hire those recently incarcerated/living off of the county, my mom is placed at the bottom of the list when it comes to being considered… its simply not right…. when target did a mass hiring for a new store in san pedro, my mother applied along with the drug dealers, those with ankle bracelets, and those buying marijuana at the mass interview…. she of course was not hired, and when we visited the store to my surprise, those other people were hired! why??? because of the tax incentive!?????! granted, some of them could have been rehabilitated and may be a great employees, who knows…. i don’t recognize any of them anymore though so perhaps it didn’t work out….. but target didn’t give my mother a chance… and there is no question that she would have been a faithful, loyal employee… after all, she has a daughter struggling in college working two jobs….. my mother recieves $1100 a month in my fathers social security (this alone disqualifies her for assistance), and has to pay $600 in rent, a storage space $47/month, a cell phone $30/month, food (?$300/month), gas (??$200/month), visa ($40/month) and car insurance ($50/month)…. and of course, when she runs out of money she has to resort to payday loans attached to her social security… don’t forget about that! it obviously isn’t enough to live off of right? so when she gets her little registry work (minimum wage, 0-10 hours a week), she uses that to cover the rest/survive… mind you, she also owes the IRS, this hasn’t gone in to repayment yet…. she qualified for $13 a month in food stamps!! that is one meal!! i dont get it!! she even gave up her room for a while and stayed in shelters and/or slept in her car! the system is set up for those that lie and cheat and have carefree lives….that WE pay for….. the people who are humnle, willing to work, honest, etc can’t get help to save their lives! where is the sense in any of this?? and now, my mom has this new penalty offered by obamacare if she doesn’t get insurance…. what a great future!! one of her fillings has fallen out…. a nerve is exposed…. no hope in dental care! she gets depressed for a lot of great reasons….it is hard to encourage her woudlnt you say? I pray and continue to pray that God will make a way and that she can see it…. because this situation here, definitely isn’t a happy one…. its really hard for her to see any kind of light at the end of the tunnel that seems to run on to infininity…. but thank you for your thoughts

  • Elizabeth Cook

    Why don’t I want Obamacare? I don’t want the IRS handling it(who knows who will have my ss number), I don’t want to be told what coverage I must have, I don’t want to be told what doctors I must use. Doctors are retiring early, some are rethinking becoming doctors, some are trying to change careers without too much expense & schooling. I have been told by friends in similar circumstances (58 to 62 yrs old) that the insurance premiums will cost 55 to 65% more. I also don’t want a socialist state. I won’t move to another country and expect the medical community to support my medical needs. I feel like I’m being voted out of my own country.

  • Eric W

    You’re hilarious. Or you would be, if you weren’t everywhere spouting this nonsense. The bible has nothing to do with this. If it did, you might be interested to look at tithing practice. The founding fathers did not lay out everything the government can do in a modern world they had no way of envisioning – if they did, we would have no use for the US supreme court, whose sole purview is to review whether laws passed or cases brought are constitutionally founded without being laid out directly in the document.

    Yes, I do feel it’s okay to reach into your pocket and take your money for other people’s use. So does *every country in the world*. They’re called taxes, and they’re how we grow as a society and as a country. They ignore the specifics of an individual’s needs in order to meet the needs of everyone. Not everybody needs a firefighter to come to their house every year, but everybody needs there to be a firefighter who can come if they need it. That is what government-enforced health insurance is. If the firefighting ‘industry’ were privatized as insurance is today, people would pay enormous amounts of money into it – because you can’t just choose to let your house burn if it happens to catch on fire. If you need a firefighter, you need him. Regardless of cost. When firefighters are required to put out fires for people who didn’t pay them, the cost gets passed on to you. When few of those people actually require aid, the money funnels instead into the lobbying industry – gobs and gobs of it – whose sole job is to fight for the status quo. Because the status quo means profits are increasing year after year for the firefighters with no end in sight. That, if you’re having difficulty understanding, is the firefighting industry reaching into your pocket and taking money for their own use. It doesn’t benefit you in any way. You have no problem with this, though, because it’s a cost and not a tax. Right? It’s not. These increasing premiums aren’t costs, they’re profit margins. It’s not getting dramatically more expensive year after year to make fire hoses. It’s getting dramatically more expensive year after year to feed the lobbying beast and to sate the ever-expanding financial hunger of the firefighting industry. It’s easier to see the big picture if you remove some of the complexity and don’t think about this in terms of healthcare but in terms of public safety or needs.

    Not that I think you’ll think about it in any terms other than where to poke superficial holes in my argument, given the level of discourse you’ve shown thus far. ‘The bible is also very specific…’ Cripes.

    • nitemare2

      Let’s clear up your “specifics
      “on tithing first. And the bible reference was done because I have had many
      discussions with liberals who bring up the bible as an argument for taxing and
      the liberal ideology of wealth redistribution so I figured I would cover that
      argument as well. Tithing is an Old Testament concept. The tithe was a requirement of the law in which all Israelites were forced to give 10 percent of everything they earned and grew to the Tabernacle/Temple, these were the money changers Jesus threw out of the temples. And this is what Jesus saidabout tithing, each one must give as he has decided in his heart, not
      reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver. Give and it
      will be given to you. Every man shall give as he is able, according to the
      blessing of the Lord your God that he has given you. Jesus did not believe in
      taxation, many use the quote of Give unto Caesar that which is Caesars, but
      they fail to state that he said all things belong to GOD.

      It’s not a profit margin increase as you say the President
      and thru ACA created a regulation saying the insurance industry must spend 80
      cents out of every premium dollar on the patients. In case you can’t figure
      they are limited to a 20% profit margin it can never go higher. That is why so many of the insurance companies have pulled out of the exchanges to wait and see if companies can survive
      the new costs and regulations. He has taxed many new insurance items and some
      insurance policies that people purchase.
      Your taxing explanation is Keynesian economics and to say that is how a
      country and a society grow is really laughable. Your ideology of the needs of the many over the one is the so called Scandinavian model” and has the goal of creating a welfare state although close to being a socialist economy it is not a state based on collective ownership. Manyof Sweden’s large private-owned companies, IKEA, H&M and Ericsson, Volvo andothers have been sold to those outside of Sweden and many have moved the Headquartersbecause of the taxations and regulations. Sweden’s political system would not work to the same effect in the United States. One reason Swedes benefit from such a system is because of its small size. Governing a society of nine million
      is unquestionably easier than trying to regulate 300+ million people. Would you
      agree to their education system also? A system where they test elementary
      students and if you don’t have a certain grade you go to a trade school not a
      college, no choice? How would the Democrats feel about that? You believe in a
      nanny state I don’t. The real question, though, which for obvious reasons
      seldom is addressed, is how businesses behave when confronted with anti-business laws and regulations (e.g., higher taxes, enviro regs, etc… The answer is pretty obvious. They
      vote with their actions, will they lay off people, cut hours or close? That
      will be seen in the future I hope it will not create more harm than we can recover

    • Giershift43

      What I see nitemare do is not address arguments with facts nor logic. He makes assertions based on emotions that blind any logic. When I present statements he doesn’t like, he tries to discount my argument not with an argument with demeaning comments suggesting that I’m not based in reality… It suggests that he does not intend on engaging in a genuine discussion, just attack anyone who does not support his views…

  • StrangerInAStrangeLand1

    Illegals can’t get Obamacare.

  • nitemare2

    It did not go through the same process as all laws. It passed by way of reconciliation a process used for budget laws which this was not. There were no debates and no amendments, check out your facts. Why because it did not have the votes in the Senate to pass and Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi slimed their way through this way. The law says you must have health insurance equal to that as required in the ACA. So I’m sorry that is being “forced”. And I was born here and was in Vietnam. So bite me and I don’t agree with your feeling of the Govt. having the right to force you to pay for everything for others from cradle to grave. Think about the fact that every time they give you something for “free” it takes away a little bit of the initiative and mental being of the people to do for themselves you know like JFK said “Think not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country and self.”

    • Giershift43

      With all due respect, I was born here as well. And my
      Late husband. Served on the Navy during the Vietnam nam war. My brother in law served in Vietnam nam and I have a cousin that served two tours of duty. Do you suggest that because I do not agree with you that I am not a loyal American?

    • Giershift43

      I sent a reply but did not see it post. I was born in this country too. My husband served in the Navy during Vietnam Nam. My brother in law serve as well. I have a cousin who served two tours of duty. Non of that is relevant to the conversation, unless you are suggesting that because I do not agree with you I am
      Not a loyal American.

      • nitemare2

        “I was born here and was around for Viet Nam” was in your post above as if you have some given right that I don’t and I figured I would explain that my military service as well as others gave you that right the same as me.

  • nitemare2

    No it’s a tax there is a difference. Yes you have to register for the Draft but there is no longer any draft so there is a difference. Car insurance is mandated if you own a car. You can drive a car without insurance. Because this law will not cut the cost of illegal immigrant care they will continue to go to the ER and they have to be treated by law and then disappear and you will pay their bill just as before and part of everyone else’s also.

  • Giershift43

    As long as you can pay cash for your health care if you become ill, then don’t have health insurance. But what happens too frequently is people without insurance get sick or hurt and we all pay for it. There are people who really can’t afford it and this would finally provide an option. I am very happy that I can keep my 21 year old on my insurance and that I can’t be denied because of a pre-existing condition. Is the Law perfect, of course not, It takes time to figure out what parts work and which don’t. But spinning our wheels and doing nothing is not a solution. It needs to be given a fair try. There are many laws which I may question there worth.
    There are laws I think should be repealed, but my representative is being denied the opportunity to vote. To me that means my vote is being abridged. I see my civil right to vote indirectly violated.

    • april showers

      Nonsense, People who don’t have insurance can pay their bills by negotiating for services and shopping around for the best price. In emergencies, they can still negotiate a better price after the fact and pay in installments. You think doctors and hospitals just don’t bill people who don’t have insurance? Obviously, people who don’t have insurance pay their bills and many times they are charged MORE for their services than people who have insurance. So you have it exactly backwards!

  • Giershift43

    If your family is large and income stretched you may be eligible for no premium or a subsidy large enough to cover your insurance. Research it first to see what you the facts are. Medicaid has situations in which children are covered, but parents excluded. That is one reason to find out specifics in the law. We are all told what to do, pay taxes, get a drivers license and sometimes a rule is not a good rule and needs to be changed; but make sure the fight you decide on is worth the effort.. Choose your battles avoid those who make assertions without specific and documented sources of information.. Like Obama care is worse than slavery just hyperbole and inflammatory.. There is way too much of that regarding this issue.

    • Giershift43

      This is from the Mint website, a money management sight. 2014, the penalty is $95 or 1% of your income, whichever is greater.

      What kinds of policies are offered through the exchanges? Do I need to worry
      about getting a lousy policy that won’t cover anything more serious than
      athlete’s foot?

      Adults under 30 and some people with low incomes can buy a catastrophic policy;
      everyone else has to buy a policy that covers the ten Essential Health Benefits.

      What are the ten essential benefits?
      Ambulatory patient services (aka outpatient treatments, minor surgery, and
      urgent care)
      Emergency services
      Maternity and newborn care
      Mental health and substance use disorder services, including behavioral health
      Prescription drugs
      Rehabilitative and habilitative services and devices
      Laboratory services
      Preventive and wellness services and chronic disease management
      Pediatric services, including oral and vision care

      What if I currently have an individual policy that doesn’t cover all of these

      You’ll probably have to upgrade.

      “If you look at some of the states that aren’t as regulated—like Ohio, for
      instance—there are some plans that cost $50 a month,” with huge deductibles,
      says Wu.

      “Plans like that that will just drop off, and people will be forced to switch.”

      Has anyone else know someone who bought and individual policy on his or her own to sadly discover that is may be inexpensive, but doesn’t cover anything…

  • Giershift43

    Social security, medicate and income taxes are optional too, just don’t work

  • ghortej

    Wow. I never though Dave Ramsey could be so obtuse. First of all, he’s right that you can’t ignore the math. Unfortunately, he ignored a great deal of it.

    He mentioned that someone who’s had 3 heart attacks is now able to get health insurance at the same rate as someone who’s healthy. And he believes that will raise you rates. But there are two problems with his supposition.

    First, he’s forgetting about the healthy young people who wouldn’t have had to purchase insurance before, who are now required to get it. Health people paying into the pool without needing expensive medical care lowers rates for everyone else.

    And second, the guy with no insurance who’s had 3 heart attacks had 3 HEART ATTACKS! Who do you think paid for the treatment of those 3 heart attacks when he was rushed to the emergency room? Was his bill magically $0? No. The hospital was required to treat that man even though they knew he couldn’t pay for his treatment. And to cover the expenses, they raised rates on everyone else. Which in turn, raised insurance premiums on everyone else.

    • april showers

      No, actually, they sent him a wildly inflated bill since he was uninsured and unable to “negotiate” his rates in advance. Then, either he paid the bill from his savings or, if he has no assets, he negotiated the rates substantially downward after the fact and paid the bill in installments or sold some property to pay off the bill. If he didn’t comply with the agreed on bill, his bill was sold to a collection agency and he could settle with them if he wanted to. If the hospital’s asset search uncovered any assets, the hospital will probably get a judgement and place lien on assets to pay the bill. This is why so many people declare bankruptcy to avoid losing property to large medical bills. The judge can reduce the bill to a reasonable payment schedule if individuals cannot or will not. Most people are ignorant of how to handle medical bills because they are so convoluted.

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